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Obama: Don’t Repeat Jerry Ford’s Big Mistake

By Thom Hartmann

If Barack Obama intends to prosecute crimes committed in the Bush White House, he’s probably wise to be cagey about it before his Attorney General is confirmed. On the other hand, if he’s going to follow in Bill Clinton’s footsteps and “look forward” instead of “backward” when it comes to crimes of previous administrations, he may well harm this nation far worse than Bush did by establishing Bush/Cheney/Rove as the “new normal” for future administrations.

Gerald Ford set a terrible precedent for the nation when he pardoned Richard Nixon, and Democrats went along with it when they decided not to continue their investigations into the many criminal acts committed in the Nixon White House.Similarly, Bill Clinton did our nation a terrible disservice when he and the Democrats, upon assuming control of the Justice Department in 1992, decided not to pursue criminal investigations into the entire scope of Iran-Contra, from Bill Casey’s alleged 1980 contacts with the Iranians about holding hostages to sink the Carter candidacy to running drugs and weapons years later with money from those same Iranians.

We can’t afford to let another organized crime operation run out of the White House under the cover of “official business” to go uninvestigated (at the very least) and punished (ideally).

If the incoming Congress and/or the Obama administration fail to thoroughly investigate all the crimes of the Bush administration--even if such an investigation will bring discomfort to complicit Democrats--it will certify that forty years of lawlessness in the White House has become the new norm. No matter how ethical and transparent and aboveboard the Obama administration may be, future administrations will believe they can break the law and cover it up as a normal part of presidential politics.

America is watching the unfolding melodrama in Illinois with a morbid fascination, shaking our collective heads at how corrupt the Blagojavich administration has been and how long they’ve gotten away with it. But at least they’re now being brought to justice, and Illinois and the political process as a whole will be better for it. Our nation deserves no less.

Comments

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If I had $1 million dollars

I would bet that Obama won't pursue crimes committed by the Bush administration.

I want him to. But I think the political system, and thus the US government, have changed. We've gone over the edge. There will no longer be accountability for anything. I take that back. There are two America's. One for the very rich and/or popular. And one for everyday folks.

For everyday folks accountability will grow. Smaller and smaller crimes will be prosecuted and the private prison system will profit from it. Meanwhile celebrities and politicians will be let off for their wrong doings.

In the world of politics, criminal investigations and impeachment are now off the table for real crimes. They are only to be pulled out for tabloid issues like marital infidelity and drug use.

Good to know

that the person responsible for executing legislation and protecting this "Goddamn piece of paper" that most of us refer to as The Constitution, plans to "look forward" instead of "looking backward" when it comes to crimes of this administration.

Nothing will stimulate the economy quicker than putting money in the hands of regular citizens, and there is no quicker way to put money in the hands of regular citizens than to allow them to rob banks.

I agree. Why look backwards at a bank robbery crime, when we can look forward in the best interest of our nation, thus allowing our 3 million newly unemployed citizens a means to obtain cash promptly to pay their bills? Forget about the damage the actual robbery does to those whose money is stolen. We just need to look forward and not backward.

If your thing is child rape, it's much more important to look forward instead of trying to determine how and why someone could rape a 6 year old little girl, and much more important than deterring future child rapists with the threat of accountability. This will just harm the nation to hold child rapists accountable when the economy is in such bad shape.

I would like to take this opportunity to declare how much of a ignorant dumbass that I, and apparently millions of Americans are, if we are suppose to fall for the elitist governing investment class protectionism and the claim that not holding rich politicians accountable for their crimes somehow benefits me personally, when the actual crimes committed hurt me more than not prosecuting them would ever help.

Giving our government back to us means that those in government are accountable to us.

Let me repeat that.

If our government is being returned to us, that means every aspect of it should be accountable to us, whether this is campaign promises and legislation, or sadly, if those in our government take it upon themselves to break the law, legal accountability.

Stop the elitist protectionism. If sentences for crimes are good for the peasants, they are good for the kings as well.

I once again will hold my judgment until Obama takes the oath of office to protect The Constitution, and until his attorney general pick is confirmed, but I am not optimistic about someone who told the old Pelosi lie of not thinking any laws were broken, when apparently special anti-constitutional revisions of previous laws were done in response to apparently not so legal stuff. What was all that retroactive immunity to?

All I can say is watch out covert CIA agents. The new chief to be is implying that you can be outted and that is not illegal, not that he would, but the door is open for any president down the road to.

Maybe Obama is just making the smart move Clinton did.

He stopped Iran/Contra investigations, perhaps thinking the Republicans would be less likely to impeach him.

How did that turn out?

You people are incredible.

You people are incredible. What crimes do you think were committed by the Bush administration while protecting your sorry asses from Islamic terrorism? Obama won't persue them because there weren't any committed. Your hatred for Bush and the fact he defeated your other messiah Algore, in 2000 has driven you lefties to insanity.

Ex-gitmo guard who saw 'torture' calls co-workers 'psychotic'

Ex-gitmo guard who saw 'torture' calls co-workers 'psychotic'
Jeremy Gantz
The Raw Story
Published: Saturday January 10, 2009

As the Guantanamo Bay detention center reached its seventh birthday this week, a U.S. veteran said he witnessed cell beatings, forced head shavings and interrogation tactics--including sleep deprivation, floor shackles and loud music--while guarding detainees there.

...

Read more at the link

Also watch Chris Arendt tell his story here:BBC link

How do you like that? A young soldier with a better understanding of morality than the Bush administration.

And tell me what is wrong

And tell me what is wrong with any of those tactics? Cell beatings were probably administered after the jailed illegal combatant threw feces or urine or even attacked the guards. Forced head shaving take place daily at prisons throughout the United States and elsewhere. Helps keep down the infestation of lice and crabs. Sleep deprivation is an interrogation technique used throughout the world on POWs or in this case illegal combatants. Floor shackles are used in most jails and prisons in the U.S.. And we are all subjected to loud music of the worst kind daily when sitting at red lights or travelling through the hood. So what is your point? I don't recall reading anything about any beheadings or arms and legs being torn off....or any of them strung up on bridge pilings after being mutilated and burned. JUST DAM!

By bebeholmesJanuary 12, 2009 - 4:56pm

It's not for me to explain what is wrong with these tactics to you. You've displayed a willingness to ignore morality on this issue time and time again. You do not care how this tarnishes the image of the US around the world. Nor do you care whether those tortured are actually guilty of terrorism or not.

Another case of trickle down stupidity:

By beenexposedasaracist January 12, 2009 - 4:56pm

Cell beatings were probably administered after the jailed illegal combatant threw feces or urine or even attacked the guards.
---------------------------
After reading this, I can only guess that, as a fetus, medical care was probably administered too long after mommy poked you in your under-developed head with a dirty hanger.
But you still lived.
____________________
"It's all been satirized for your protection." --Maher

Stop, just stop...

There will be no trials, no charges and not even any serious mutterings of them in the congress so the far kook left might as well just moveon.org.

Silly libs......

OH, and Obama may have said today that he promises to order GTMO closed soon, but you'll note he doesn't specify when IT WILL CLOSE. I'm thinking some time AFTER the election in 2016 when he's a lame duck, unless he's ousted in the 2012 election (doubtful).

The best part of an Obama Presidency is that Hillary will NEVER be President..

Seven Years of Guantánamo

This is a nice article on Guantánamo:

Seven Years of Guantánamo,
Seven Years of Torture and Lies

by Andy Worthington
January 12, 2009

Excerpt:

...

"These people are committed terrorists," [Rumsfeld] declared on Jan. 22, 2002, in the same press conference at which he spoke about the photos. "We are keeping them off the street and out of the airlines and out of nuclear power plants and out of ports across this country and across other countries." On a visit to Guantánamo five days later, he called the prisoners "among the most dangerous, best-trained, vicious killers on the face of the earth."

Seven years after Guantánamo opened, it should be abundantly clear that neither Rumsfeld nor Vice President Dick Cheney, President Bush, or any of the other defenders of Guantánamo who indulged in similarly hysterical rhetoric had any idea what they were talking about.

The administration did all in its power to prevent anyone outside the U.S. military and the intelligence services from examining the stories of the men (or even knowing who they were) to see if there was any truth to their assertions, but as details emerged in the long years that followed, it became clear that at least 86 percent [.pdf] of the prisoners were not captured on the battlefields of Afghanistan, as the government alleged, but were seized by the Americans' allies in Afghanistan – and also in Pakistan – at a time when bounty payments, averaging $5,000 a head, were widespread.

...

By twilight druid January 12, 2009 - 9:08pm

A useful reference:

REPORT ON GUANTANAMO DETAINEES
A Profile of 517 Detainees through Analysis of Department of Defense Data
Professor Mark Denbeaux* and Joshua Denbeaux*

1. Fifty-five percent (55%) of the detainees are not determined to have committed any
hostile acts against the United States or its coalition allies.

2. Only 8% of the detainees were characterized as al Qaeda fighters.

3. ...60% -- are detained merely because they are “associated with” a group or groups the
Government asserts are terrorist organizations...

4. 86% of the detainees were arrested by either Pakistan or the Northern Alliance and turned over to United States
custody.

Item 4 is what was pointed out several time son this board. Usually to deaf ears when it comes to the right wing trolls. However, while it has become clear that the trolls that visit this board have no moral code and lack any ability for rational thought, the general population is becoming more aware of the fact that most prisoners in this facility are in fact simply political prisoners that were handed over to the US, and not Al Qaeda fighters/agents caught by the US.

It is pointless to "debate" Guantánamo with a right wing troll. But it is not pointless to post this material for the visitors to this board to see.

If Obama does not go after Bush and his cabal of criminals,

he will be breaking his solemn oath to uphold and defend the Constitution. It will show us, and the world, that restoring our moral standing and respect is of little importance.

"I'm always amazed when I hear people saying; "That George Bush, he's a great leader". And I wonder, where can one find a drug that would make one so delusional?" Lewis Black

By Pookie2112January 12, 2009 - 10:39pm

Then Pook, you had better get used to calling President Obama an "oath breaker" because he just isn't gonna do it. Say what you want about Bush, but since 9/11 there hasn't been a single attack on US soil. On 9/12 if anybody has said we'd be free of attacks for the next 7 years, I'd have told them they're crazy.

Face it, there will be no hearings, no trials and President Obama will NOT take any steps to go after the Bush administration on war issues.... That's just the way it is.....

Oh and he my ORDER Gitmo to BE closed, now let's see how long before it actually closes......

The best part of an Obama Presidency is that Hillary will NEVER be President..

By StillaFRightenedTwit January 13, 2009 - 6:02am

Say what you want about Bush...
-------------------------
OK. He's a filthy war criminal who will go down as the worst pResident in American history.

...but since 9/11 there hasn't been a single attack on US soil.
-------------------------
So, those anthrax attacks were just a figment of everyone's imagination, right?
Boy, you sure do like mindlessly regurgitating bumper-sticker talking points, regardless of their veracity.

On 9/12 if anybody has said we'd be free of attacks for the next 7 years, I'd have told them they're crazy.
-------------------------
And six days later, on 9/18, they would not have only been proven crazy, but also wrong.
Just like you.

But don't let stop you. I'm sure everyone here enjoys an easy target to fire at...
____________________
"It's all been satirized for your protection." --Maher

By SJerseyIndyJanuary 13, 2009 - 8:17am

SJ,

The actions of one person acting alone with no group affiliation or sanction do not a terrorist attack make....

Was Oswald was not a terrorist, he was a murderer.... Bruce Ivins (suspect) is (was) a murderer if he did it. He was a terrorist if he did it under order of some group affiliation......

The 9/11 guys were acting under the orders of Al Queda. The

The best part of an Obama Presidency is that Hillary will NEVER be President..

But! But!! But!!! StillWhinin ...

You said he wouldn't close GITMO and it looks like he WILL! Oh, my! Could it be because you don't know what the fuck your talking about?! Why, I do believe that is a resounding YES.

Time will prove you wrong, stillwhinin. And, yawn - you're a bore.

"I'm always amazed when I hear people saying; "That George Bush, he's a great leader". And I wonder, where can one find a drug that would make one so delusional?" Lewis Black

By Pookie2112January 13, 2009 - 12:11pm

Again, signing the order the close the camp is one thing. When is it gonna close...? That is a different matter..... We'll see. We'll see when they ACTUALLY close the place...

The best part of an Obama Presidency is that Hillary will NEVER be President..

Well, StillWhinin ....

I don't care it if it's tomorrow or two years from now ... it will CLOSE. I just hope they pack all those "terraists" in a facility in Florida so you will further shit your pants, coward.

"I'm always amazed when I hear people saying; "That George Bush, he's a great leader". And I wonder, where can one find a drug that would make one so delusional?" Lewis Black

By Pookie2112January 13, 2009 - 10:33pm

Yep, it'll close alright... In a few years. And if that is the decision of the President, so be it.....

After all, we tortured a Saudi National who WOULD have been on the planes... Here is how we tortured hiim...

-Isolation
-Nudity
-Sleep dep
-Exposure to cold

OH THE HUMANITY!

Interrogation techniques used on Qahtani included sustained isolation, sleep deprivation, nudity and prolonged exposure to cold. He was hospitalized twice.
Qahtani, allegedly planned to be the plot’’s 20th hijacker, was interrogated from November 2002 to January 2003 after being captured in Afghanistan. (ANI)

OH WHAAAAAAAAA! This man wanted to kill himself and others in a jet, yet libs WHINE because we kept him awake and made him uncomfortable.... WHAAAAAAAAAA. Cry me a river. He should be dead.... Give him to the Saudi Govt and let them behead his terrorist ass...

The best part of an Obama Presidency is that Hillary will NEVER be President..

StillWhinin - You're such a dumbass.

Prospects of trial uncertain
In November 2006, senior investigators with the Defense Department's Criminal Investigation Task Force (CITF) told MSNBC.com that they were told by military prosecutors that al-Kahtani would be "unprosecutable" because of what was done to him during interrogation.

www.wikipedia.com

Yup, torture really DOES work - you get the completely opposite results. Yawn.

"I'm always amazed when I hear people saying; "That George Bush, he's a great leader". And I wonder, where can one find a drug that would make one so delusional?" Lewis Black

By Pookie2112January 14, 2009 - 12:22pm

I totally agree with you on this one Pook. We simply cannot put this man on trial.

We should immediatly and without hesitation repatriate him to Sauid Arabia.

Common ground...

Love ya, mean it...

The best part of an Obama Presidency is that Hillary will NEVER be President..

StillWhinin ... yawn.

"I'm always amazed when I hear people saying; "That George Bush, he's a great leader". And I wonder, where can one find a drug that would make one so delusional?" Lewis Black

And as for morality, what is

And as for morality, what is more immoral that taking a hard working achiever's property (money) and giving it away to a non-working, non-achieving, tick on society.

You would know about being a tick on society,cracker.

You've been leeching for eon's. Just put a bullet between your eyes and stop leeching off us hard-working Americans, bohunk.

"I'm always amazed when I hear people saying; "That George Bush, he's a great leader". And I wonder, where can one find a drug that would make one so delusional?" Lewis Black

By Pookie2112January 13, 2009 - 12:13pm

He looks like a tick about to pop.

By twilight druidJanuary 13, 2009 - 11:44am

Oh, my! That will make quite the mess!! LMAO - Thanks for that, twilight, I needed a good laugh!!

"I'm always amazed when I hear people saying; "That George Bush, he's a great leader". And I wonder, where can one find a drug that would make one so delusional?" Lewis Black

And of all people to talk

And of all people to talk about morality, we have gutterslut...er...pookie, an avowed abortionist who would just as soon kill an unborn baby as look at it's sonogram. So when you are laying in bed thinking of all the Palestinian children that Hamas is causing to die, think also of all those unborn, helpless babies that you and your feminist liberal friends murder each year.

By bebeholmesJanuary 13, 2009 - 4:05pm

waaa!!!

You're a whiner.

Cracker, you post your lies as if I care

LOL, newsflash, bohunk - I don't.

"I'm always amazed when I hear people saying; "That George Bush, he's a great leader". And I wonder, where can one find a drug that would make one so delusional?" Lewis Black

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